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Forum:2009-04-03 (Friday)
Discussion for comic for . I am guessing that today's page means that we have to update Tiktoffen's page here? I am not quite sure what to say, though. I've made a minor edit saying that his loyalty is an open question. Perhaps beyond that we should just wait and see. --Aquillion 00:59, 4 April 2009 (UTC) :That one page could go in so many directions. Personally, I figured it was a case of 'I know who you are, and I'll use it as a trump card when I need to' smile, but that's just my thought. --Donovan Ravenhull 05:39, 4 April 2009 (UTC) :Agreed. It seems pretty clear that Tiktoffen knows Gil's true identity, but his motive for keeping it secret need not be loyalty to the Wulfenbachs. If I was in Tiktoffen's shoes, I'd want Gil around while I was walking round Castle Heterodyne, even if I planned to kill him the second we got out of the place! Rancke 08:11, 4 April 2009 (UTC) :: Yes. If Zola's plans go down in flames, he can say to Gil "I saved your life" (an exaggeration, but he can say it), but if Gil gets discovered and killed by Zola's minions he hasn't done anything unreasonable. He's still trying to play both sides. Argadi 09:54, 4 April 2009 (UTC) :::Well, just keep in mind that Tiktoffen is at least a double agent (Wulfenbach's spy on the prisoners, then The Council's agent to overthrow Wulfenbach), now possibly angling to be a triple agent. Also, think about the kind of person who would survive in a man-eating trash heap long enough to carve out a safe place and set himself up as leader of it. In a standard fairy tale, it would be the prisoner whose noble spirit earned the grudging respect of all the other inmates... but this isn't a standard fairy tale; it's a Foglio one. I'd guess that Tiktoffen became the ruler of the trash heap by tossing the bodies of his fellow inmates (and, of course, any competitor to his leadership) into the meat grinder, until the gears finally jammed. :::The last frame is just a reminder that, despite his usual "helpful hapless hobo" appearance, Tiktoffen is probably the most vicious and ruthless character we've seen yet. If he's clever enough to keep the other, more dangerous prisoners in line, probably by playing one off against another and getting any real hazards used as "trap detectors," he's more than clever enough to take over both Zola's and Gil's little information shell games and turn them to his own ends. :::So, who might he really be working for? He no doubt has little love and even less loyalty to anyone in the Wulfenbach line, Klaus being the reason he was sent to the Castle in the first place. Self-interest demands that he keep Gil alive, though, if only so his actions keep Zola (and Klaus, who is probably planning to do something about the Heterodyne girl) distracted. If he can weave his web so that Gil thinks he owes Tiktoffen, even with just a quick distraction, so much the better. On the other hand, the presence of the Heterodyne girl and the fact that Zola's army still haven't been seen stomping through the streets of Mechanicsburg means that Zola's plans have almost certainly dissolved, and a survivor doesn't stay alive by sticking with losers. :::If Tiktoffen has any human ego at all, his real goal is probably continuing to eliminate any challenges to his leadership, which will include both Zola and Agatha (and Gil, who's trying to save both). Having survived and set himself up as king of the trash heap, he would almost certainly fight any effort to uproot him, even if he would receive his freedom in exchange. Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven, after all. --Tatter D 17:27, 4 April 2009 (UTC) :::Really? Being king of the trash heap sucks. Not everyone has what it takes to be Satan. I find it more likely that he'd be trying to convince them both that he's on their side so that no matter who wins, then he'll be able to leave this hell behind him and be their minion. --NoSanninWa 18:41, 5 April 2009 (UTC) :::: And what offense got Tiktoffen castle duty in the first place? Rej Maddog 07:53, 5 April 2009 (UTC) ::::If he didn't have what it takes to be Satan, he would be a lackey like Moloch, insted of king of the trash heap. The only real question is, will he be willing to leave behind the petty little empire he's carved out when Agatha tells him he can go, or will he fight to keep it? Again, it depends on which way the Foglios decide to take the story, and I wouldn't discount the possibility of him taking a third route that we couldn't possibly suspect. --Tatter D 19:17, 5 April 2009 (UTC) :::::The most likely result of his actions is that he finds that he's managed to set fire to the bridge he standing on from both ends when Agatha (with Gil and Tarvek) get things going. I don't know if we are looking at 'dead man walking' here, but at the minimum he's gonna be left making fish faces as his world crashes around him. --Donovan Ravenhull 23:07, 5 April 2009 (UTC)